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It’s payback time: If the Vista team could write ad copy …

Nov. 7, 2007 Paul Thurrott | Paul Thurrott's Supersite for Windows

Mary Jo Foley made me laugh out loud with this one. It's just good stuff, and well deserved.

Apple advocates are doing the unthinkable: They’re complaining publicly about a new Apple product release.

It’s payback time: If the Vista team could write ad copy …Even typically staunch Mac backers are admitting that Apple’s new Leopard operating system is not perfect. It might even be as problem-prone (if not more so) as Windows Vista. Could Leopard go so far as to drive some switchers into Vista’s arms? Sounds crazy, but who knows...

If you’re Microsoft — especially a member of the Vista team — there’s no way you can help but gloat. Very few Softies or their loyal followers are gloating publicly. But there’s no way they aren’t enjoying this turning of the tables.

If Microsoft would and could create a new Vista vs. Leopard campaign, which route should it take?

  • Leopard: 300 New Features, 300 New Bugs
  • SIOOMA*, Mac zealots. Namaste. Peace out.
  • Broadscale Beta Tests are for Sissies, Huh?
  • Leopard vs. Vista: May the most hated operating system win
  • Friends don’t let friends buy Leopard (without an SP1)

This one's so funny, I'm making a promo graphic. :)

Discuss this Article 12

daveinla
on Nov 7, 2007
The problem is Tiger is too goddam good !!!! I can't get to leave it ! :-(( Not for a few eye-candies and possibly some minor bugs. Maybe 10.5.2 will entice me. As for the article I understand that the Vista team must be happy seeing that they are not the only one not being able to deliver a product on par with expectations, even though Leopard runs just as fine as Tiger did on old machines... As Paul said earlier, OS development have come to a plateau and the only good thing an OS dev team can bring now is a few goodies and make the system leaner and run more efficiently, all this with the fewest bugs possible. Vista just added the eye candies and the bugs, Leopard gave all three. Vista had it harder as it was a newly designed foundation as OS X 10.0 was (osX 10.0 was slooooow). Now we will see if the Microsoft OS dev team is as good as the Apple OS dev team in getting the OS to be more and more efficient and stable with each SP release. In that case, Vista SP2 should be able to run on a 5 year old machine of today.... I'm skeptical for now ...
fivepoint
on Nov 7, 2007
It [Leopard] might even be as problem-prone (if not more so) as Windows Vista. Could Leopard go so far as to drive some switchers into Vista’s arms? Sounds crazy, but who knows... HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHA! TALK ABOUT GRASPING STRAWS! Seriously though... SIOOMA.
ii_infinitum
on Nov 7, 2007
I've been using OS 10.5 since the day it came out on 3 different machines and have had very few problems at all. All my programs work. The only 2 problems I've had is that my iCal backups didn't work (thankfully my entire iCal was also on my iPhone) and that initially there was no way to get Quicksilver's icon out of the dock. To be fair I am running the new OS on relatively recent hardware. (Gen 1 MacBook Pro, Gen 1 MacBook, and Gen 1 Dual 2GHz G5) It is unfair to compare the 2 OS's in that fact that they are fundamentally different upgrades. Vista is a major system upgrade almost on the scale of the first move to the NT architecture. OS X 10.5 falls somewhere in between an upgrade like XP and a service-pack like XP SP2. It introduces new features, but makes fewer architectural changes in the system. (also much cheaper license) A more accurate comparison would be between OS X 10.0 and Vista. Because of the differences I believe that Apple should be held to a higher standard for 10.5 than Microsoft for Vista's initial release. Criticism of tan OS is good for both companies, but not when it is done in a childish way like the linked article did. I will admit that there was a lot f childish articles form the Mac community when Vista came out, and I'm not excusing those, but in the same way there is no excuse for Mary Jo Foley's article either. Note: I do use Macs as my primary machines so my opinion may be a little slanted towards Apple, but I endeavor to remain objective.
DRWAM
on Nov 7, 2007
ii_infinitum, I agree with you. Leopard has no problems on my two machines, one is 8 yrs old with a CPU upgrade. However, the upgrade seems incremental, rather than an overhall. As far as Mary Jo is concerned, I think that she should stay in the kitchen. Paul feeds me the info that I crave from the OS'es, so thanks Paul.
MaryW
on Nov 7, 2007
Mary Jo makes a good point. I have never witnessed such dissatisfaction in an OS upgrade...... ever! I fully expect to see all of the Mac's recent market share gains wiped out by January 2008. What were they thinking?
cesjr
on Nov 7, 2007
sorry but the good reviews for Leopard continue to roll in - the only people begging to differ are folks strongly in MS's camp (Paul, Mary Joe Foley and now Joe Wilcox) and perpetual winers like Dave Winer (quoted by Foley). Hate to break it to you guys, but a few bugs don't turn Leopard into Vista. Far, far from it. In today's online edition of Computerworld - Leopard Spanks Vista ""Throughout the four years of the Vista development process, I tested and evaluated at least 15 different alphas and betas of the operating system, spending hundreds of hours evaluating the late prereleases and the final editions. Likewise, I spent countless hours testing Leopard, both in prerelease form and the final version now available to the public. What I found after all that testing is that despite their similarities on paper, Leopard and Vista are nothing alike," Finnie reports. "Vista has a cover-Microsoft's-butt, designed-by-corporate-committee feel, while Leopard tightly adheres to Apple's well-honed user-interface design principles. In numerous small ways, Apple has improved its OS, while Microsoft has, in a plethora of ways, changed Windows -- not always for the better," Finnie reports. "With OS X 10.5, Apple is clearly going head to head with Microsoft and Vista. With the smoke clearing, it's also apparent that Apple still has a lead on Microsoft when it comes to user interface and functionality." "It's impossible to miss the refinement infused throughout Apple's new operating system, whereas there are compromises in Vista that impinge upon the user experience without giving something back in return. Apple is focused on the user experience, while Microsoft appears to be focused on antipiracy, overengineered security protections, and digital rights management aimed at serving its prospective third-party partners," Finnie reports. "There's really no contest. Tiger is a better OS than Vista, and there are no long-term downsides to Leopard. Vista doesn't measure up." http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic&...
drylight
on Nov 7, 2007
Mary jumped the gun on Dave Winer's comments.. this is what he actually meant (as he said in a follow-up post): "When I said Leopard feels like Windows, I meant that it locks up, disappears, freezes and crashes. That I have to trick it into doing the right thing. I wasn’t paying Windows a compliment, geez, you guys need to learn how to read." Certainly makes Vista seem like a great OS. "Vista 1000 ways to screw you over."
shark47
on Nov 7, 2007
Great! All this after publicly mocking Microsoft at every given opportunity. Maybe this'll teach Steve Jobs the meaning of "humility". On the other hand, maybe this will all be forgotten soon. It takes only one keynote address from Steve Jobs to make his followers swoon.
Cfischer83
on Nov 7, 2007
Coming from a guy who has had no problems with Vista, I can tell you that although Vista does take up more resources, it is FAR more efficient than XP. I did a test to see when I would notice performance issues, and although my Vista machine had more RAM (2GB compared to 1GB), my XP machine had a faster processor (2.2ghz compared to 1.9ghz). It took about 7 - 8 applications in XP before I noticed a performance issue, and about 26 applications in Vista (and I'm talking about apps like the whole Office suite, Macromedia suite, IE, Firefox, Opera, Safari, Photoshop etc.), so to suggest that Vista is less efficient is absolutely ignorant! I'm not saying my XP machine is bad either, it's the best XP machine I've ever used, but Vista is on a whole new playing field. Also, since Vista is a newly architectured OS, you'd expect a few bugs (and that's what there were, a "few"), but to have so many problems with a service pack like Leopard is just embarrassing for Apple.
RunTimeError
on Nov 7, 2007
Hey Mr. Paul "I'm fair and unbiased" Thurrott: Nice. Real nice. Oh, and this: http://www.winsupersite.com/images/vista/welcome_leopard_switchers_02.jpg Classy. Then again, if you can't beat 'em, join 'em. Right?
Waethorn
on Nov 8, 2007
A prediction come true: http://www.ifilm.com/video/2869092 That's all I gotta say.
Yawn!
on Nov 8, 2007
Paul, You so badly want that "in your face" coming out of Mircosoft, but you continue to get: "It’s payback time: If the Vista team could write ad copy … then they would be able to program "hello world" in one line of code. Vista (sp2) maybe.

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