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Note to Apple: Vista is fixed.

Oct. 22, 2008 Paul Thurrott | Paul Thurrott's Supersite for Windows

Deep Thought states the obvious, though it bears repeating:

Apple’s relentless anti-Vista smear campaign continues, with its latest round of “Mac vs. PC” commercials accusing Microsoft of spending money on marketing that it could be spending to “fix Vista.”

Here’s a note to Apple: Vista is fixed. It’s called Service Pack 1, a release that, by all accounts, addresses the vast majority of issues Vista had at launch. Windows Vista with SP1 is fast, stable and highly capable, and despite Apple’s relentless smear campaign, people are gradually beginning to realize that Vista isn’t as bad as they’d been led to believe.

It’s time for Apple to stop the smearing and go back to focusing on the positive aspects of Mac OS X.

When did they ever do that?  :) No, seriously. When?

Anyway, a second note to anyone who’s listening: Vista SP1 was finalized back in February. So Vista isn’t just fixed. It’s been fixed for over 6 months.

Discuss this Article 79

tayme
on Oct 22, 2008
Look...its adouble your hits, Paul Thurrott 2fer day!!! Enjoy! --tayme
dreimanis
on Oct 22, 2008
Paul, you are like Don Quixote in a Macworld :)
volwrath
on Oct 22, 2008
heh let apple's arrogant attitude continue. in this economy, people aren't going to be able to afford their crap much longer. my daughter does like her $199 16g nano, but I equally like my $48 10gb Sansa.
mikegalos@msn.com
on Oct 22, 2008
To sell on technological advantages (either as customer benefits or features) requires that you have some technological advantages. To sell on bashing a straw man caricature only requires a lack of honesty. I wonder which will prevail with Apple's Macintosh marketing in the future...
roblind
on Oct 22, 2008
The new Apple ads are simply expressions of the traditional, immature Apple brand = condescending contempt for their competition. If you would like to read some stories about what still needs fixing with Leopard, just check out this site: http://macintouch.com/readerreports/leopard/topic4381.html Pull the plank out your own eye Apple before you point out the speck in your competition's eye.
Ocean
on Oct 22, 2008
Its not fixed in the consumers mind...and thats all that really matters: >>Microsoft has been stepping back from Vista for some time now. In early October, Microsoft quietly announced that it was extending sales of XP Professional SP3. In my opinion, XP SP3 is a much better operating system than Vista will ever be. Before that, Microsoft started fast-tracking Windows 7 and deemphasizing Vista. I've also noticed that, after giving up on those terrible Bill Gates and Seinfeld ads, Microsoft's equally awful "I'm a PC" ads seem to be disappearing off the airwaves.<< http://blogs.computerworld.com/ballmer_says_skip_vista
Ocean
on Oct 22, 2008
This is truly jaw-dropping: >>The majority of large businesses and government agencies in the United States, including Maine's IT department, will likely skip Vista entirely and proceed directly to Windows 7 from Windows XP. And a survey released earlier this month by the United Kingdom's Corporate IT Forum showed that only 4% of businesses in that country are using Vista, which has now been on the market for almost two years. So, 4% corporate adoption in two years -- now that's what I call success! And how about those 1-5 Seattle Seahawks, Steve -- ya picking them to go all the way? So how is Ballmer defining Vista's success? Sheer numbers tell the tale, insists Microsoft's CEO. The company sold more than 180 million copies of Vista during the OS's first 18 months on the market, making it Microsoft's best-selling product ever, Ballmer noted. But numbers don't tell the whole story. In fact, they're quite misleading. Damn lies and statistics and all that. Vista has outsold Windows XP in terms of units shipped, but only because the PC market is today twice as big as it was when XP debuted in late 2001. Adjusting for market size, Vista lays an egg in comparison.<< http://www.informationweek.com/blog/main/archives/2008/10/ballmer_micros...
lehenbauer
on Oct 22, 2008
"Here's sand in your eye." -- big bully Apple to poor little Microsoft
gorath
on Oct 22, 2008
I really don't understand why people even try to make something of the fact that MS is working on 7, and that it will not carry the Vista name over. Did you really think they were going to sit still for years, under a presumption that they had done all that needed to be done? And what exactly is this deemphasis of Vista that is mentioned? Are people referring to the exictement about Winows7 being shown for the first time (albeit in a very early milestone build) at PDC next week, and confusing that for "microsoft is ignoring Vista"? Seriously what gives? Are you just making stuff up?
meason
on Oct 22, 2008
I have actually had more issues with OS X Tiger/lepoard on my 8/2007 mac book then I have had with vista since day one on several older and brand new machines..... go figure.
Ocean
on Oct 22, 2008
Us techies might blame the hardware in SacredCows post...but in the consumers mind it's Vista. Thanks Sacred!
dovella
on Oct 22, 2008
Leopard SP5 :D and not Work http://discussions.apple.com/category.jspa?categoryID=235 problem problem problem Fortunately that runs on standard hardware :D :D App£€ it's a time GO TO HOME
Ocean
on Oct 22, 2008
>>discussions.apple.com/category.jspa problem problem problem<< What do you expect to find on a SUPPORT page?
scoobyclub
on Oct 22, 2008
Just because it's sp1 doesn't make it fixed. However I know Paul has a book now telling you all how to make Vista sp1 work. It's one hell of a mother of a volume.
Ocean
on Oct 22, 2008
Scooby: AWESOME!!!!
Waethorn
on Oct 22, 2008
"However I know Paul has a book now telling you all how to make Vista sp1 work. It's one hell of a mother of a volume." It's a pull-out banner with the words "1) TURN ON COMPUTER, 2) YOU'RE DONE!". ;)
whiplash55
on Oct 22, 2008
Having used Leopard from 10.5.1-10.5.4 Apple has nothing to talk about. It was a horrible mess, I tried "up-grading the machine to Tiger" and it worked great before I sold it. Vista is a fine OS but face the "switcher adds" never had anything to do with reality. When are they going to fix Leopard, I think its called Snow Leopard, Apple has stated that it's intended to fix stability problems with Leopard. Even one of the admitted Mac fanboys on MacBreak Weekly called Leopard "the most unstable OS he's used" and had to install Tiger on his production machines. Oh, and the new Macbooks with no Firewire, so much for video editing on your laptop. And the track pad is a total P.O.S. Sorry over-priced over-hyped only works for the true believers, even a few of them are wondering if Stevo has lost his touch.
deepfry
on Oct 22, 2008
I have no problem with Vista on a 2003-era Athlon XP pc.... that being said we aren't even looking at Vista yet in our office - our slate is a little busy with other projects at the moment, though apparently it is on the "distant future" projects - we might end up just going to 7. Of course, that being said, we went right from NT to XP, skipping 2000 on the desktops....we seem to be on an "every other version" schedule. :)
chuckb84
on Oct 22, 2008
Vista is fixed, Vista is fixed! Buy my book! Why Paul might be just a touch biased: http://www.winsupersite.com/images/blog/winsecrets_sp1_29books.jpg Does ANYONE take this guy seriously when he writes about Apple? Why?
whiplash55
on Oct 22, 2008
@deepfry Our department just started rolling out XP in late 06- early 07. I can't believe the number of people in enterprise still using 2000. I'm not surprised many people aren't upgrading to Vista, especially with all the pure B.S. I hear about it.
DRWAM
on Oct 22, 2008
It's funny how people make claim to many 'problems' and yet I have yet to experience any on Leopard, and the only problem with Vista SP1 was that it takes several tries, but eventually connects to my VPN. Otherwise no problems with either, and one is a $400 Vista laptop! [I got it in again Mike, and the day's not over yet!]. Maybe just doofuses have problems with their computer.
whiplash55
on Oct 22, 2008
Does ANYONE take this guy seriously when he writes about Apple? Why? More so than anything Apple says about anything. Paul actually uses Apple products and frequently praises them when he feels they deserve it (And far more than I would). When Apple gets away with blatant BS and pathetic sycophants lap it up, it gets annoying. So he wrote a book on using Vista, so has many other people, some that also write books about Macs. I've yet to hear any objective person describe the Apple ads. as accurate.
robertsjoe
on Oct 22, 2008
It's been fixed was it? Why is SP2 coming out? Vista is riddled with problems.
Nickelgreen
on Oct 22, 2008
Guys you naively don't realize that Microsoft SPs are not like the ones during XP era. SP1 for vista is MAINLY a collection of hotfixes released via Windows Update regularly. There are some minor changes which required a service pack (like the kernel update or some compatibility fixes for example) separately from Windows Update stuff. But Microsoft service packs in years 2007-2008 are mainly collection of patches, hotfixes and so on. The same is due for SP2 if you read the news with accuracy. By the way, telling us that more than 200 million people have nightmare experiences with Vista PC means really living in fairy tales. You should concentrate in improving your common sense instead of emphatizing only what you like to read (which, actually, is pretty far from everyday reality).
rtkachuk@shaw.ca
on Oct 22, 2008
@robertsjoe If a service pack is proof of problems, what does the 6 mega pack for Leopard say about OS X? Horribly broken, rushing to put out Slow Leopard to cover their failures with the original, borked Leopard, maybe?
Nickelgreen
on Oct 22, 2008
@chuckb84 1) Paul's book is called "Vista secrets" and not "How to turn a gargantuan mess of os into a slightly acceptable joke". Read it accurately... 2) I suggest you to read the book or at least the table of content which are deeply listed in the dedicated page here, explaining that the book is mainly an exploration of Vista known, not known and hidden features. 3) Paul writes for living...
whiplash55
on Oct 22, 2008
Since when does a service pack have anything to do with OS reliability or whether or not it has problems. Service Packs have traditionally been done to roll up hotfixes and updates. Apple charges for theirs, MS generally does not. Vista is riddled with problems. Why not name some, a lot.! If you're saying riddled with problems then lets see your list.
shark47
on Oct 22, 2008
"Its not fixed in the consumers mind...and thats all that really matters:" What An Idiotic Comment. So, Apple can continue to spread FUD about Vista as long as consumers don't think it's fixed? That's acceptable, eh? I call BS to that. A lie is a lie, even if it's perceived to be the truth. An optical illusion is still that - an illusion. The iDefenders are getting ridiculous now.
DRWAM
on Oct 22, 2008
Nickle is right, and I'm even a Mac user. I was actually making the same statement to my wife when we viewed the most recent Apple commercial. She asked if Vista still had problems, then why did we buy a [cheapo $400] Vista Laptop. I told her that Vista is fine now, and worked pretty well to begin with, although I tested it about a year after it was released. Mac OS and Windows are so close now that there's little left to differ to the average user. My Vista experience since January or February has a very easy automatic everything setup. I still prefer my Mac for home use, and never had a problem with Leopard either, and not even a [non-clean] upgrade as well. I like both, but Vista [and Leopard] just doesn't seem to be broken. And this post is a funny coincidence to what I was exactly thinking two nights ago. Mike, I got my cheapo laptop in again. I told you so!
RaggieSoft
on Oct 22, 2008
Should anyone be surprised? The iSheep are behaving like usual. Always attacking Microsoft. Whenever Steve says "do this," the iFlock will always obey without question. I for one still play good old DOS games in Vista. Try OS 9 apps in OX 10.5... :::hears crickets chirping:::
cesjr
on Oct 22, 2008
Read the comments to the Deep Though piece. Lots of people are flat out disagreeing that Vista is fixed. Because Paul says its fixed . . . doesn't mean its fixed. It's a matter of opinion and lots of people don't think it is
robertsjoe
on Oct 22, 2008
@rtkachuk: "If a service pack is proof of problems, what does the 6 mega pack for Leopard say about OS X? Horribly broken, rushing to put out Slow Leopard to cover their failures with the original, borked Leopard, maybe?" I never said a SP was a proof of problems. Paul intimated that: "Anyway, a second note to anyone who’s listening: Vista SP1 was finalized back in February. So Vista isn’t just fixed. It’s been fixed for over 6 months." Vista was broken because it's now fixed because SP1 has been out for 6 months. So by that theory there are still problems because SP2 is coming. As for service packs. Have you seen what a horror it is to install Vista and the Windows Updates that follow on a new machine. Truly horrendous experience. Then again, Windows (tm) is known for it.
robertsjoe
on Oct 22, 2008
@whiplash55: Since when does a service pack have anything to do with OS reliability or whether or not it has problems. I never said that, Paul intimated it with the last bit of the post.
robertsjoe
on Oct 22, 2008
@whiplash55: "Vista is riddled with problems. Why not name some, a lot.! If you're saying riddled with problems then lets see your list." You don't need a list. Use Vista then OS X. You'll see just how bad Vista really is.
robertsjoe
on Oct 22, 2008
@raggiesoft: "Should anyone be surprised? The iSheep are behaving like usual. Always attacking Microsoft. Whenever Steve says "do this," the iFlock will always obey without question. Always attacking Microsoft. Oh you poor babies! ;( Ever actually read this blog and others like it? All they are obsessed with is attacking Apple. "I for one still play good old DOS games in Vista. Try OS 9 apps in OX 10.5... :::hears crickets chirping:::" Wow, this is something to be proud of?! You can run DOS games (an OS from the early 80's) on an OS in 2008? That's part of why Vista is so bad.
Nickelgreen
on Oct 22, 2008
I agree with you DRWAM. I'd like to add that with Vista I have the best Windows experience EVER. I used every version (well, sort of): dos, 3.11, windows95, windows98 and 98SE, Windows Me, Windows 2000 and XP. I rarely had annoyances with them but the best performance is actually with Vista. And this has been since day one and on every Vista pc I put my hands on. That's why I lose my temper when I read web fud spread by the few (gartner, mossberg, guttman, kingsley-hughes): It's unreal and they lie (or exagerate at least) knowing to do so. Apple behaviour is no different. Picard: "They invade our space, and we fall back. They assimilate entire worlds, and we fall back. Not again. The line must be drawn here! This far and no further!" (this quote is just for fun, obviously...)
Nickelgreen
on Oct 22, 2008
<> I use both and I haven't come to your conclusion. However your argumentation sound poor to me. <> This sounds paricularly funny if you notice the fact that so many "compliants" are about Vista compatibility.
Master3
on Oct 22, 2008
"You don't need a list. Use Vista then OS X. You'll see just how bad Vista really is." Ok, that's not going to cut it. He asked for a list. Now provide one, not some bulls#ite like the above.
DRWAM
on Oct 22, 2008
I never thought of that Nickle. I have the same experience, that Vista has been better than 95, 98, Me and XP. The service calls from friends have decreased ass they have adopted Vista too. I like both OSes, but Vista has given me more reason to cheer, since those XP help phone calls are rare now.
Master3
on Oct 22, 2008
"Wow, this is something to be proud of?! You can run DOS games (an OS from the early 80's) on an OS in 2008? That's part of why Vista is so bad." Yes it is somthing to bbe proud of. It's called added value. We can run applications, many that are still as useful as they were years ago, with ease. Not only does this save consumers money, it takes the concern away that with the next OS release, my applications, some which may be custom, wont work. In the Apple world, this may be totally ok, as you get to shove out more $$$ into the Apple ecosystem, but for the vast majority of the computing world, it is a godsend. example: Dragon Naturally Speaking 10 = over $100 Dragon Naturally Speaking 6 = $10 If MS had your attitude, I would have to use version 10 and pay the extra cash. No Thanks.
RaggieSoft
on Oct 22, 2008
Yes, I happily run old DOS games. The ideas is that even with Vista, you can' OS X can't even run OS 9 apps. Sad indeed. And no, I'm not some poor baby: I've been a reader of this blog for a while (I don't comment that much). iSheep: always attack because Steve says so
konnexion
on Oct 22, 2008
It's quite obvious a lot of people here have never used Vista. I don't understand where they get the energy and time to make statements they cant support. Vista isn't and hasn't been broken for a very long time. Rock solid here. I use use and love both OSX & Vista - but I would cringe to be identified as one of these Apple loving eejits. Apple is spreading lies about Vista - pure and simple - and it's getting tired.
.Chris1990
on Oct 22, 2008
ahh paul you make me laugh. I bought vista a week after launch, and it was solid. no problems.. you your self like to bash apple and cover the news at the same time.... so its a double standard...
robertsjoe
on Oct 22, 2008
Check out the latest Get A Mac ad,, just baked fresh today. http://movies.apple.com/movies/us/apple/getamac/apple_getamac_bakesale_2... It's funny, 'cause it's all true. Spend those bucks on ads to fix Vista's problems.
tayme
on Oct 22, 2008
Wow...amazing. Here are hard and true facts - My XP laptop runs great. No issues at all. My Vista PC runs great. No issues at all. My OS X Tiger PC runs great. No issues at all. My OS X Leopard/Vista MBP runs great. No issues at all. My old P3 Compaq running Suse Linux runs great. No issues at all. And yes, my sisters cheapo ACER laptop running Vista runs great. No issues at all. What does all of this mean? Its really kind of creepy, don't you think? --tayme
hodari
on Oct 22, 2008
Vista is very solid and reliable - The best windows exprience I have had since inception of windows 386! My leopard macbook (sold) invaribaly so many times the macbook would not see my printer on the network and would not see other computers on the networks. Apple knows about this problem and even after installing 10.5.5 update the problem is still there. They have still not figured out how the Updated SMB Protocol works!.
robertsjoe
on Oct 22, 2008
"My leopard macbook (sold) invaribaly so many times the macbook would not see my printer on the network and would not see other computers on the networks" Probably caused by Vista's SMB2, the details of which Microsoft does not share with anyone. Or it could be Microsoft's bastardized implementation of SMB1, which they also like to keep closed. That's what you get for dealing with a company that loves closed standards.
mdsharpe
on Oct 22, 2008
Having used Vista at home for over 2 years, and at work for the last 8 months, I can agree without a doubt, if Vista ever was broken, it's fixed. Apple's continual Vista bashing is sad, pathetic and leaves me kinda feeling sorry for them.
dovella
on Oct 22, 2008
@Ocean Apple hardware is STANDARD. shall not be eligible to see some mistakes
Mum
on Oct 22, 2008
"Vista SP1 was finalized back in February. So Vista isn’t just fixed. It’s been fixed for over 6 months." Color management (reliable monitor color profile loading at startup/wake, to be more specific) is still not fixed in Vista. Of course, that only bothers people who do anything serious with photographs, web design, print design or video. So please don't try to tell any graphic pro that "Vista is fixed". The whole freaking graphic industry has no choice but to stay on Macs or downgrade to XP if buying PC's to consistently get the color they want. So where's the money going, marketing or fixing Vista?

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