Ubuntu Says Microsoft's Netbook Claims are True

Chris Kenyon from Ubuntu sponsor Canonical has posted a rebuttal of sorts to Microsoft's netbook market share claims, which it calls "FUD." Most of it is an opinion piece, so let's just jump straight to the relevant bits. It requires a lot of cut and paste, because he intersperses little bits of data--data that is rarely backed up--with lots and lots of side discussion.

To be clear, Microsoft recently made the following claims:

1. 96 percent of netbooks sold in the US are sold with Windows, according to NPD.

2. The return rate for Linux-based notebooks is 4x the return rate of Windows-based notebooks, according to leading netbook vendors.

The Ubuntu claims are:

The price of XP crashed last year due to competition. So even if you bought a netbook last year with XP - feel free to smile when you see an Ubuntu PC. It’s amazing what an open market can achieve.

... True, but this just backs up what Microsoft is saying and what the data suggests: Once the price of XP fell to accommodate low priced netbooks, Windows market share on those machines skyrocketed at the expense of Linux.

The really big news for the industry is that well-engineered Linux netbooks have similar return rates to XP.

... but he offers no data to back that up. (Emphasis on "well-engineered" was mine. "Well-engineered"?)

Not too long ago, not a single PC manufacturer was shipping Ubuntu .... [Today] Dell, HP, and Toshiba are all shipping Ubuntu.

... True. And completely irrelevant to a discussion about netbook marketshare, however. Obviously, Linux market share on regular computers is even lower than that of netbooks. But again, that's not part of this discussion.

And my favorite bit, which of course comes right at the end:

If we are going to compete, let’s do it on real facts and actual statements. You’re better than that, Redmond.

Apparently, Canonical is not better than that. Please read the entire post. There isn't a single shred of evidence or data in there that refutes the claims Microsoft made, just a single baseless line stating that "well-engineered" Linux netbooks have similar return rates to XP. Interesting qualifier.

So let's be clear about what this really is: Ubuntu/Canonical felt it had to respond to Microsoft's widely reported claims. But all it really did was implicitly agree that Microsoft's claims about netbook market share and return rates are, in fact, true.

Looked at another way, it is Canonical, not Microsoft, that is guilty of FUD. Microsoft offers evidence where Canonical offers prose and opinion. That's FUD.

Discuss this Article 96

hamiltonstallings
on Apr 15, 2009
Shut up you idiots. As for Windows XP on netbooks.. I feel like I am the only one out there that wonders why get a netbook in the first place, no matter what OS is on it. How did this netbook fad get so popular and when will it end?
notawindowsuser
on Apr 15, 2009
@tayme "but arguing with you is an exercise in futility, as you like to twist and turn things said to meet your needs. and continue to put words in other's mouths - at the same time that you complain that others do that to you." I'm with you on that one, I call him MikeStrawmanGalos, myself, but having said that, I did miss your posts when you where gone Mike, you make me laugh.
Waethorn
on Apr 15, 2009
@losta: I was joking. I dunno what was more funny: your original comment, or trying to deflect it. Either way, it was LULZ-worthy. ....so is bringing up taxes on "Tax Day". (Not for me - we have until the end of the month. I already did mine though.)
Waethorn
on Apr 15, 2009
"How did this netbook fad get so popular" When people (read: Americans) decided they couldn't afford a real computer. ie. shortly before the US election
anonymous
on Apr 15, 2009
BEGINTRANSMIT hamiltonstallings - "Shut up you idiots." Make me! Oooh, you carbonoids really burn my eight-legged britches! I am so angry, I could follow the example of Htlacthu, the Unholy One, and switch to Linux just to spite you. That will learn you! ENDTRANSMIT
gorath
on Apr 15, 2009
@ hamiltonstallings I think people are settling for underpowered netbooks for the same reason they're settling for crappy quality youtube videos, low-quality compressed music, "ever-advancing" technology that doesn't actually enable us to do anything new and/or interesting and so on. I don't know what that reason is, but I'm pretty sure it's linked to all of the above. @Mikegalos et all - people with informed opinions are fine. People with strong opinions, who decide to bring those opinions to venues completely unrelated to them, however, are pretty annoying. What are you going to do next, start posting on a motorsports forum about the pros and cons of catholicism?
Waethorn
on Apr 15, 2009
Off-topic (but no more so than anything else here): Does anybody know if WDS supports a unattended "configset"? I know it supports a separate $OEM$ folder that resides outside of the image, but WinSIM supports something called a "Configuration Set" which includes drivers and other scripts that don't get copied as part of the $OEM$ folder structure. Instead, they're integrated in the installation, normally by way of direct access to the network distribution share. I'm just wondering if WDS supports it too. There's a lot of things that WDS doesn't do though, like allow multiple images to be applied in a single process, unless you either package it inside the base WIM or included it in the $OEM$ files, and script installation manually with ImageX. WDS doesn't support DataImages at all. According to most of what I've read, it only supports Sysprepped OS installation images (and boot images for, obviously, just PXE booting). The reason I ask is because I'd like to keep baseline images intact for the installation, but also keep drivers separate so that they're easy to replace when updated. I could use PEIMG to integrate the drivers into the image, but then cleaning out old drivers to replace them with new ones is a big chore. The only way I could see that it's possible is if I put them in a folder under $OEM$, script the installation (they all have EXE installers that support silent install), and then delete them afterwards. It's better than slipstreaming them, but it's still more work than a ConfigSet. With a ConfigSet, you just put a couple of entries in the Unattend.XML file that point to the driver folders on the share and Setup just scans the folders and subfolders for INF's automatically. Suggestions would be appreciated. I'm looking at ways to optimize my OEM deployment methods. Not much is mentioned about using WDS as an option to BUILD deployment images on a reference - just to deploy them. I hate having to do umpteen manual commands in a WinPE commandline just to build and capture images when WDS handles most of the grunt work with a couple of clicks. One of the big issues is that there isn't an easy way to deploy multiple images, making WinRE partitions impossible to deploy natively. It takes a lot to work around the limitations of WDS. I really hope they make future versions of WDS with the same kind of functionality you can get from the commandline tools. Right now, it's both a blessing and a curse. ....I do like the Multicast options though - that's really sped up deployment speed across the network.
aemarques
on Apr 15, 2009
Late last year, I had this conversation with a sales clerk in a big computer store in Lisbon (that's in Portugal...) about the EeePC, after seeing that all the machines there were Linux ones: Me: So, just out of curiosity, how many XP vs Linux machines do you usually receive from Asus? Sales Clerk (SC): Well, just about 50/50. What happens is that all the XP machines sell out rapidly; then, because we don't receive any more, we start to sell the Linux ones also. Me: So, and people like them also, right? I mean, this is just for websurfing... SC: Well, the truth is... *Most* of the Linux machines that we sell are returned within a week. Part are from people that did not realized that this was a Linux machine; the other part is from people that *did know* that these were Linux machines, but thought that they could install XP anyway - and they had trouble doing it... Is this anedoctal evidence? Of course. But I don't find very difficult to believe that this happens a lot elsewere - and not only in Portugal!
tayme
on Apr 15, 2009
@lotsamystuff - Just for you. Read it closely and remember, it comes from the left leaning MSNBC. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/30222789 --tayme
aemarques
on Apr 15, 2009
@Waethorn: BTW, the netbooks are much more popular in Europe than in the USA... Just look at the sales statistics from Asus and Acer, for instance.
Waethorn
on Apr 15, 2009
@aemarques: I kind of wonder what the difference was in price that they were selling the Linux EeePC's for over the Windows versions.
lotsamystuff
on Apr 15, 2009
I'm sorry, "tayme", but where in that article does it say (as you allege) that the "current administrations plan(s) to put soldiers that are returning after serving on a watch list."? Because I must have missed that part. THAT is the citation I'm asking for. I have read or heard of no such plans, but maybe at one of your tea parties someone gave you a flier with a website address you could pass on. And FWIW, I read the homeland security report (which was written in cooperation with the FBI, and titled, ""Right-wing Extremism: Current Economic and Political Climate Fueling Resurgence in Radicalization and Recruitment." Frankly, I agree with much of the report's conclusions. For those of you desiring a copy: http://www.thelibertypapers.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/hsa-rightwing...
aemarques
on Apr 15, 2009
@Waethorn. In Portugal, in December 2008, this was around a 50 euros difference, around 299 euros for the Linux machine vs. 349 euros for the XP version. But the prices droped since that time. Last week, I saw an EeePC 901 with Linux selling for 199 euros. And some local cellular operators are "giving" away Toshiba NB100 and Dell Mini with integrated 3G slots (all XP versions) to anyone that buys a 2 year contract...!
lotsamystuff
on Apr 15, 2009
Oh, and "tayme"...FWIW: "In fact, the Obama administration in January did issue a warning about left-wing extremists. Both reports were initiated during the administration of former President George W. Bush." So you're blaming the wrong guy. http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/04/14/extremism.report/
mikegalos@msn.com
on Apr 15, 2009
gorath I agree that things should stay on topic but I'd also say that if somebody else brings up an offtopic post, it's unreasonable to say that nobody should reply and only their view should remain visible. That only rewards those who carpetbomb with off topic posts. Note that I was not the one who brought up tax policy. Hence, please direct your complaint to tayme for luching offtopic to make political commentary on both President Obama and US Tax Policy.
tayme
on Apr 15, 2009
You guys that are extremists on things are so easy to manipulate and get worked up and distracted. Keep in mind that most of the US is more centrist than either the left wing or right wing nut jobs...or the iCabal or WinJihad. You make it too easy! --tayme
Lindy
on Apr 15, 2009
OT, want Microsoft news? Not getting that at the Winsupersite? Here is more news about the new Zune HD, its looking to be a amazing device....at least on paper. http://www.macworld.com/article/140014/2009/04/zunehd.html All the Windows news you need with out the PT shark jumping:)
lotsamystuff
on Apr 15, 2009
"You guys that are extremists on things are so easy to manipulate and get worked up and distracted." And you "guys" that make unfounded provocative accusations are poisonous to the debate, particularly when you can't back them up.
Waethorn
on Apr 15, 2009
"And you "guys" that make unfounded provocative accusations" you mean like a certain someone that accused someone of "teabagging" his fellow constituents?
lotsamystuff
on Apr 15, 2009
I explained myself, Wae. Get over it. You're tilting at windmills.
mikegalos@msn.com
on Apr 15, 2009
It's amusing how often on this board somebody makes a ridiculous statement, argues their point with nothing but arrogance and ignorance and then says, "Hey, I was only kidding". Well, at least in this case, lotsa admits for one reason or another that the points he made earlier were, in fact, something no reasonable person would believe.
chuckb84
on Apr 15, 2009
Mike, "It's amusing how often on this board somebody makes a ridiculous statement, argues their point with nothing but arrogance and ignorance and then says, "Hey, I was only kidding". Kinda like Paul with the "How Mac Fanatics See the World", "It's a joke guys. :) Geesh." The level of hypocrisy here is what's really amusing.
shark47
on Apr 15, 2009
"As for Windows XP on netbooks.. I feel like I am the only one out there that wonders why get a netbook in the first place, no matter what OS is on it. " Considering how cheap laptops are, I don't see the point in getting an underpowered machine without a DVD drive and with a tiny screen. To each is their own, I guess.
tayme
on Apr 15, 2009
Who said they were kidding? I don't see that anywhere in this thread. mikegalos must be putting words in people's mouth again. Amazing how mikegalos does that and then b1tches about it when others do that to him. Oh, the double standards... --tayme
robertsjoe
on Apr 15, 2009
Of course it's Microsoft FUD. Like the recent "report" which was paid for by Microsoft. No one takes them seriously.
tayme
on Apr 15, 2009
@hamiltonstallings - I agree with you on the netbooks. I think that they came about from the wonderful OLPC project --tayme
mikegalos@msn.com
on Apr 15, 2009
Shark What I've seen (and it's purely anecdotal from family and friends) is that netbooks are being bought not by people who are trying to save a little money over a regular laptop but by people who want a small, lightweight web, email and document device to keep around wherever they go. They're not buying them instead of a normal desktop or laptop, they're buying them in addtion to their main machines.
tayme
on Apr 15, 2009
@"lotsamystuff" - "And you "guys" that make unfounded provocative accusations are poisonous to the debate, particularly when you can't back them up." That's funny, coming from the likes of you. You have been so quiet and respectful to all on Paul's sites over the years! Drop the false shock and get over yourself. --tayme
tayme
on Apr 15, 2009
@Bobbi Jo - Its you that nobody takes seriously...How was school today? --tayme
robertsjoe
on Apr 15, 2009
New Office products announced. http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/features/2009/Apr09/04-15Office2010.mspx Like anyone cares about this? It's like when IBM announces something. Only corporates care. No one outside of business does. Microsoft, the new IBM. Big and boring.
tayme
on Apr 15, 2009
@Bobbi Jo - Obviously Apple cares...they were sure proud when they could announce that the iPhone could use Exchange ActiveSync. Apple the new Microsoft, big and out to get your money. --tayme
Master3
on Apr 15, 2009
This thread is officially dead. Turn off the lights, Paul.
Waethorn
on Apr 15, 2009
@master: How many ______'s does it take to unscrew that light bulb?
benjwah
on Apr 15, 2009
Despite what Paul says, I'm quite sure that this will definitely be... THE YEAR OF DESKTOP LINUX! Sorry, had to. And no, I wasn't being serious.
robertsjoe
on Apr 15, 2009
@tayme: "Apple the new Microsoft, big and out to get your money." So you agree that Microsoft is just big and out to get your money. Taking any measures necessary to do so. Thank you. At least you agree.
robertsjoe
on Apr 15, 2009
@mikegalos: "Well, at least in this case, lotsa admits for one reason or another that the points he made earlier were, in fact, something no reasonable person would believe." Unfortunately it's not something we can say about you. Admitting you were wrong or handing out incorrect drudgery about Microsoft.
shark47
on Apr 15, 2009
"So you agree that Microsoft is just big and out to get your money. " Oh, really? I thought Microsoft was running a charity here. Oh my God. They actually want money? Why can't every company be magnanimous like Apple?
whiplash55
on Apr 15, 2009
Seems like if Linux ever had a chance it was with Netbooks. After all the first few versions only ran Linux, now the only retail place I could find a Linux Netbook in the Bay Area I'm talking Santa Clara Sunnyvale and Cupertino was Target?? Micro Center, Best Buy, and Fry"s all had Windows only versions. Kinda sad if there ever was a platform where the OS was less relevant it would be a Netbook. One of these days I'll buy one I'd like to see if PC-BSD would run on one. Its a pretty nice OS and installs apps very similar to Mac's and PC's. Then again I'd end up wiping the drive and installing Win 7 like I did with the Thinkpad I'd used it on.
Dipsh t Admin
on Apr 16, 2009
Netbooks are typically a second or third computer. It isn't only about the price, but it is in some ways. Very few would buy a netbook as a primary computer, but plenty will buy one so that they have something extremely portable and nearly disposable to do simple tasks.
tayme
on Apr 16, 2009
@Bobbi Jo - So you agree that Apple was thrilled to be able to announce Exchange ActiveSync support for the iPhone and is also in business to make a profit...oh the shame. Maybe you are starting to come around to reality! School time...better get in there before the bell rings! --tayme
chuckb84
on Apr 16, 2009
" "As for Windows XP on netbooks.. I feel like I am the only one out there that wonders why get a netbook in the first place, no matter what OS is on it. " Considering how cheap laptops are, I don't see the point in getting an underpowered machine without a DVD drive and with a tiny screen. To each is their own, I guess." Yah, I don't see the point to Netbooks either. Needs vary, but I'm real happy with a 15" Macbook Pro that I dock to a keyboard and 2nd monitor and then take with me when I'm mobile. This seems to me a better solution than a desktop and netbook because I --never-- worry about all the synchronization issues, do I have a particular file, is the email on which device, etc. For uber portability, the iPhone works well. If I'm on the go and can't manage what I need with the iPhone, it tethers the MBP and I work that way. The only issue is typing on a plane, and my attitude is that plane rides are now so excruciating that I just read or listen to music or watch a movie on the iPhone.
anonymous
on Apr 16, 2009
BEGINTRANSMIT My, it is a glorious day as the incandescent spherical plasmoid you orbit rises above your horizon. Let us celebrate it with petty name-calling and bickering about which operating system is superior, and thus the best extension of our manhood. I feel like having bacon. ENDTRANSMIT
CapnScurvy
on Apr 16, 2009
Arrgghhh! Tis a fine vessel ye have here, matey. I think I shall keelhaul it and shiver its timbers up and down the mainline. And of course, swab ye p00p deck of Waethorn's mother. Blimey, tis bigger than the accursed white whale I give chase to! Arrgghhh!
mikegalos@msn.com
on Apr 16, 2009
Well, FormerCommander TPlak, If you feel like having bacon, I'd suggest BACONOPOLIS next Friday in Seattle. http://www.tomdouglas.com/events/view/id/23
tayme
on Apr 16, 2009
Last night was a good night...watching people speak their minds at the many Tea Parties around the country and watching the liberal media make fools of themselves once again. I thoroughly enjoyed it all. --tayme
mikegalos@msn.com
on Apr 16, 2009
tayme, Never before have I seen so much teabagging done in public. And it was nice to see people making use of the public parks our tax dollars pay for.

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