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Zune 2.5

May 6, 2008 Paul Thurrott | Paul Thurrott's Supersite for Windows

Microsoft issued a major update to its Zune software today:

We've updated the Zune software with features our community's been asking for, including gapless playback, smart playlists, new sorting options, multiple-device syncing, and advanced song info editing, including drag-and-drop functionality. If you have Windows Live Messenger running, it'll let your contacts know what you're playing. And when you go to Zune Marketplace, you'll now find over 600 episodes of popular TV shows to download, plus more than two million DRM-free MP3s.

Great news for members of the Zune Social: the discovery experience is now fully integrated into this update. Send messages and listening recommendations directly from the software. Zune Pass subscribers: sync your friends' Zune Cards with your device and their music comes along—their recent plays, favorite tracks, and top songs from their most-played artists. Even if you don't have a Zune Pass, you'll still see their play data on your device, so you can choose what you want and buy the songs next time you sync.

Expect some shots and a review soon. I would point out, however, that the Zune guys promised something new around TV content, and this just appears to be a copy of what Apple's doing. Not sure what's going on there yet.

Discuss this Article 26

johnpapola
on May 6, 2008
Paul, is the Zune software built with WPF or any of the new tech from Vista? I'm just curious to see what's happening with that and since this is new first-party software in the post-Vista era, I would hope they're using the tools.
dstrack
on May 6, 2008
The updates are welcome... and the NBC content missing from iTunes showing up on Zune is pretty cool (even if it is short lived). I like the Zune Card sharing. Can't wait to get home and play around with it.
jvd897
on May 6, 2008
@johnpapola: The Zune software is built on the same technologies as Windows Media Center, neither of which are WPF, unfortunately. SWEET! All this makes me at least 10x more likely to buy a Zune. Now if only Microsoft would release it in Canada, like they said they would...
Lindy
on May 6, 2008
I can still see from the screen shots they use MS points. 160 points for an episode. Does Vista come with a Ultimate Extra, MS points to your currency converter, maybe a sidebar gadget?? Maybe someone will make a dummies book. Love the pink background as well, so cool.
Waethorn
on May 6, 2008
"Now if only Microsoft would release it in Canada, like they said they would..." June.
johnpapola
on May 6, 2008
@jvd897 Man, if Microsoft isn't even using their new tools for first party applications like this, it's no wonder the third party software pool is a mess of win32 junk. Get with the program, guys.
Cfischer83
on May 6, 2008
Yeah... downloaded the update and it crashed my computer... thank God for system restore!
matt.brown
on May 6, 2008
Yeah, the MS points system is pretty ridiculous. The best feature of the new update is that podcasts with numbers in the title are in the correct order now as opposed to the file system order (i.e. 1, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 2, 20, etc.). That was pretty annoying on the old software.
Waethorn
on May 6, 2008
Hey Paul! If this is a "major update" why didn't they change the version to 3.0? Um, does that mean we'll be treated to another complete UI revision on 3.0 instead? (Not that I mind the current one, but 1.0 was just terrible by comparison.)
fivepoint
on May 7, 2008
@PaulThurott Paul, I expected to see your take on this article from the Motley Fool: "Microsoft was bold enough to walk out on Microhoo. Will it be brave enough to bail on its Zune, as well?" http://www.fool.com/investing/value/2008/05/06/leaving-so-zune.aspx More from the Fool: "Anything else and you're just fighting a losing battle. The Zune will never be an iPod killer. Truth be told, it will never even get close enough to be an iPod tickler."
tayme
on May 7, 2008
@fivepoint - This would fall under the heading of "The best product is not always the best *selling* product." My family and I have used both iPods and Zunes, along with Creative Zen...Zune is by far the best piece of hardware. The software is getting there, along with the Marketplace. --tayme
subzerohitman721
on May 7, 2008
I'm glad to see that Microsoft hasn't bailed on Zune, however Zune 2.5 isn't enough to bail on my iPod. The state of my iTunes account stays strong and any attempt to change me to Zune... I will Veto It. (Sorry for the pun, Paul. I could not help it. Great Address by the way. LOL.) The NBC/Universal deal was a no brainer but curious. Aren't they charging the same amount on the iTunes except for certain content? Or are they just getting more cash from MS?
pthurrott
on May 7, 2008
Lots of stuff here.... Zune 2.5 is a major update regardless of what the actual version number is. So far the major point releases have been platform changes. Zune 2 is not built on WPF as someone pointed out. Zune's getting better. Should they bail? Arguably they should never have done it at all. 3 percent market share and 2 million units sold after 18 months on the market? Come on. That's 2-3 weeks for Apple. Microsoft Points s&$%. Obviously.
johnpapola
on May 7, 2008
Agreed on all fronts, Paul. Then there's this: http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/05/07/microsoft-may-build-a-copyright... "Second, Apple refused to cooperate with NBC on building filters into its iPod player to remove pirated movies and videos. Microsoft, by contrast, will accept NBC’s pricing scheme and will work with it to try to develop a copyright “cop” to be installed on its devices." First they get on all fours for Universal music with $1 per zune. Now, they promise to prevent non-drm video from being imported. Now, which media player is more, closed? Someone please remind me. ps. I agree that wholesale pricing should be left to the content creator. If they want to hang themselves with high prices... let them. There's plenty of competitive content on iTunes and elsewhere for consumers to download instead.
Waethorn
on May 7, 2008
"Now, they promise to prevent non-drm video from being imported." WRONG! 10 seconds of research found this in the same story, and immediately after the quote you stated: "For now, both issues are rather theoretical." and of course, the NY Times is notorious for not doing their own 10 seconds of research. Not once in the article does it mention that Microsoft was contacted to confirm any of this, hence they'd rather take the weasel way out and to call it all "theoretical". I could say Steve Jobs likes to lick my B@11s, but that's just a theory too. Likewise, I'll point to this: "If you like to download the latest episodes of “Heroes” or other NBC shows from BitTorrent, maybe you shouldn’t buy a Microsoft Zune to watch them on." And who would be pirating TV programs off of Bittorrent? Of course, goodie two-shoes Mackie's wouldn't now would they? They would buy TV shows off of iTunes, while yet another tech "journalist" assumes that PC users would rather just pirate them. What a crock! If you buy TV shows from Zune Marketplace, there's no problem, and of course, if you're using a Zune, you're only buying TV from one place - Zune Marketplace. The only other semi-legal option is if you use Media Center and record TV, but DVRMS already has support for the broadcast flag, so content creators will eventually utilize that to control content flow, and it's a total non-story. As Lindy says, nobody cares about DRM. I'll second that and add that when it comes to downloading TV content for a closed-ecosystem such as Zune, iPod, or XBOX Live Marketplace, it only affects people that pirate content, or try to use it beyond their rights. If you download content from iTunes, Zune, Rhapsody, etc., you have limited playback options whether you like it or not - you can't burn it to DVD, and you have limited device and computer playback options. Maybe if and when all music moves to DRM-free (likely not going to happen), TV content will slowly move to it as well (even less likely to happen).
Waethorn
on May 7, 2008
Here you go: http://www.news.com/8301-13860_3-9938650-56.html?part=rss&subj=news&tag=... http://zuneinsider.com/archive/2008/05/07/just-so-no-one-gets-the-wrong-... As usual....10 seconds of research is all it takes.... Right Paul?
johnpapola
on May 7, 2008
Well, look at that. NY Times really blew it on this one. Not really a surprise. Mainstream media outlets get the facts wrong so often on tech reporting, you have to wonder why they even bother. Thanks for the link, Waethorn, though, as usual, your biased, bigoted ranting about "mackies" is off the charts weird. Same old zealot hack rants. Grow up, please. I personally don't tend to hit up bittorrent as I make my living in TV and think piracy is stealing. If my DVR messes up and I miss a show on HBO, I sometimes go online for it... but I'm a paying subscriber. Does that make me a "goodie two shoes"? I guess, if obeying the law, morality and having respect for the work and effort that goes into producing quality programming is being a "goodie two shoes". If, however, you're some jerk that thinks all content should be "free"... enjoy your future of cats playing the piano. I prefer Battlestar and Lost personally.
Waethorn
on May 8, 2008
"Mainstream media outlets get the facts wrong so often on tech reporting, you have to wonder why they even bother." ....and I wonder why you even bother repeating it as canon, and also totally falsify it by saying that it was a "promise". Liar! "Same old zealot hack rants. Grow up, please." ....and yet you completely chart new territory in bad marketing by finding some way of [falsely] trying to discredit Microsoft. Grow up, indeed! "I personally don't tend to hit up bittorrent as I make my living in TV and think piracy is stealing. If my DVR messes up and I miss a show on HBO, I sometimes go online for it... but I'm a paying subscriber." If you download from a source that is not an authorized distributor then nobody makes any money, hence you are advocating piracy. "If, however, you're some jerk that thinks all content should be "free"... enjoy your future of cats playing the piano." No, unlike someone that downloads off of Bittorrent so that advertising capital is marginalized. You are no better than those that steal videos outright from Bittorrent....Really, a marketing hack should know better!
johnpapola
on May 8, 2008
"Liar" Fair enough. They don't appear to have "promised". They committed to try and look into it. From an update to the article: "Here is what Mr. Sohn, the Microsoft spokesman, told me yesterday when I asked him about what Mr. Perrette said: “I don’t think they are wrong, but we are not going to characterize those discussions.” Later he added, “We have agreed to work with NBC across a range of topics, and protection of copyrighted material is certainly one of them.”" "No, unlike someone that downloads off of Bittorrent so that advertising capital is marginalized. You are no better than those that steal videos outright from Bittorrent....Really, a marketing hack should know better!" "Marketing Hack". Nice. What are you even talking about? HBO isn't advertiser supported. Their shows are aired ad-free. Obviously. And I pay $15+/month to have it and on-demand. The on-demand quality sometimes sucks, so in that case I've on the occasion used a torrent to catch up on a show if my DVR screwed up and missed it. Waethorn, only you would argue with me on something we appear to agree about: that video piracy is wrong. Get a life.
johnpapola
on May 8, 2008
Also, it's pretty obvious here that Microsoft is winking at someone. Either they're winking at the users by downplaying this commitment to pursue filtering (but with no intention to really do so). Or, they're winking at NBC that they WILL implement it and are trying to save face with users by backpedaling on the blog. Either way, they're not being as forthright as Apple is about content filtering.
Waethorn
on May 8, 2008
"they're winking at NBC that they WILL implement it and are trying to save face with users by backpedaling on the blog." backpedalling what exactly? Microsoft never stated they were persuing it at all. again, I'll save Paul the trouble: "LIAR!"
johnpapola
on May 8, 2008
"LIAR!" I guess this is your new troll copy-and-paste line. I'm obviously speculating, but again, here's what Microsoft is saying: "We have agreed to work with NBC across a range of topics, and protection of copyrighted material is certainly one of them." I obviously don't know what went into that discussion, but I'm guessing that Microsoft was being far more agreeable about this ludicrous filtering idea than Apple's categorical "no". Waethorn, you've obviously never been in any kind of higher-level corporate meetings or negotiations. There's a lot of stuff that stays in the boardroom. Insinuations. Hand-shake stuff. Apple just said No. Microsoft said they'd look into it. Both know it's a terrible idea. Only Apple is being honest about it.
Waethorn
on May 8, 2008
"Apple just said No....Only Apple is being honest about it." you're speculating. by your own admittal, "There's a lot of stuff that stays in the boardroom. Insinuations. Hand-shake stuff." you have no clue. quit pretending to know what goes on in Apple's boardroom. "I'm obviously speculating" on both counts.
DRWAM
on May 8, 2008
Time for me to back pedal. I bought the refurb Sansa c150 2GB MP3 player at Buy.com for $10 [was $20 with $10 off when opening a new Google account based on your email address. Open as many as you want] and free shipping. The older m-series did not need [XP] software to load music, but alas, this series does. It does not software on my Mac or with Vista [opens with Explorer], but there is some pics and music on it already that I cannot find when I open it on the Mac desktop. However, I can change them with Vista. Vista wins as most handy with the c-series Sansa.
halesgarcia
on May 9, 2008
I like the new Zune ad. It's really fun-ny. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIk4qTKmKzE
lotsamystuff
on May 10, 2008
"Microsoft never stated they were persuing [sic] it at all." Wrong. Or should I say,"LIAR!" "We have agreed to work with NBC across a range of topics, and protection of copyrighted material is certainly one of them.” - Microsoft Spokesman Adam Sohn Yes, "Waethorn", they are "pursuing" it.

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