iTunes is not reliable

At least on my desktop PC, that is.

You may recall from my Firefox 3 vs. Windows Vista posts from a while back that I had been lamenting that bugginess in Mozilla's latest browser (later tied to particular add-ons) had been bringing down my PC's reliability index. What's weird is that the reliability index has never really recovered since then either, despite a few valiant attempts. This time around, it's not Firefox, however. (In fact, Firefox 3 has been notably reliable.) No, this time it's iTunes.

Here's a shot of the index:

The 30-day high point came on June 20, 2008, when my PC registered a reliability index score of 8.09. Since then, it's been up and down, mostly down, and mostly because of iTunes. In fact, of the 8 "bad days" seen above (and denoted by red X's), four of them were solely caused by iTunes and another, in outlook.exe, was caused when I had trouble syncing with iTunes. (I can't definitely blame that one on Apple, but I'll throw it out there, since this is the only reason I even use Outlook.)

In fact, over those 8 bad days, there were a total of 16 application failures. Here's how they break down:

iTunes.exe   5
WindowsMailSync.exe (for iTunes) 4
LVPrcSrv.exe (Logitech) 2
Outlook.exe 2
Communications_Helper.exe (Logitech) 1
wmplayer.exe 1
wlcrdpsystem.exe (unknown) 1

As you can see, iTunes and a related exe are responsible for 9 of the 16 application failures over the last 30 days. And probably 11, if you count Outlook.exe. Which I do, but I think you could make an argument otherwise.

Today, the index is at 7.30 thanks to two consecutive days of iTunes.exe crashes, which is what made me think to look.

For whatever it's worth, my Vista-based Macbook is considerably more reliable. Since coming online on June 16, there has been only one application failure (explorer.exe) and two "miscellaneous" failures (both disruptive shutdowns). The reliability index score on that machine is 9.33 and its always hovered right near a perfect 10.

Weird.

I'm not sure if this is meaningful, but the desktop is running Vista x64 while the Macbook is running Vista x86 (32-bit).

Discuss this Article 48

lotsamystuff
on Jul 17, 2008
The WinJihadist baits the "iCabal". Wow, Paul. What a headline. Why didn't you write something honest, like "WinJihadist Tech Writer Experiences Random Problem With Single Machine, Writes Provocative Headline!" I used to think you were the Windows equivalent of Jon Gruber, but even Gruber wouldn't pull something stupid like this. Of course it's not meaningful. But "meaningful" analysis is apparently in short supply on this site.
weedmonk
on Jul 17, 2008
AVG 9 will treat iTunes as Malware. :D
Snakedoctor1
on Jul 17, 2008
Honestly brother is there no other news but Apple news. What is the name of this site? It needs to be changed.
procario
on Jul 17, 2008
Are you running the 64 bit iTunes or the 32 bit iTunes? I recently got a Vista laptop for my daughter and when I attempted to install the 32 bit version, I got a warning saying that I should use the 64 bit version. I did and it has been fine. Of course she does not have a iPhone to sync.
BrightrevCarl
on Jul 17, 2008
Paul isn't the first person to complain about either iTunes reliability or performance on Windows. I would have written the same thing if I had the same problems with iTunes. The headline is a little sensational, but it does describe the experience he's had. I use JRMediaCenter with my iPod Nano and it rarely if ever crashes, with the standard disclaimer that I'm just a happy customer and I have nothing to do with the company. I'm not looking forward to using iTunes when I (eventually) buy an iPhone 3G.
pthurrott
on Jul 17, 2008
Pointless comments from lotsamystuff notwithstanding, far more people use iTunes on Windows than on the Mac. It's not "apple news," it's information about an application hundreds of millions of people use ... on Windows.
DRWAM
on Jul 17, 2008
Ha, and you all wonder why I don't like using iTunes [or Safari] EVEN ON A MAC, let alone my PC's! This is just one more nail in the home use coffin for this young doc. My wife keeps nagging me to put her new album on her iPod shuffle, but I just don't want to install iTunes on her PC. Can one of you call her and explain this? I guess it doesn't matter, as I will lose anyway.
Josh_Miller
on Jul 17, 2008
I used to run iTunes but for some reason one day it stopped working. I've tried several fixes and I can't even get it to install anymore. It tells me things like "Your Audio Device is in use" and such. I have no problems with sound using any other player (or program for that matter) so I just switched to Windows media Player.
Ocean
on Jul 17, 2008
Apple passes Acer to become third largest U.S. PC vendor -- Now has 8.5 percent market share. http://blogs.chron.com/techblog/archives/2008/07/linpost_7172008.html
anonymous
on Jul 17, 2008
[...] an interesting post was made today on this site [...]...
Snakedoctor1
on Jul 17, 2008
I agree with your Paul, of the 100+ million iPod users I am sure most are on Windows. Its just that I come here Windows news but lately its been Apple....Apple...Apple. I have only ever run iTunes on OS X and its fine. My wife has iTunes on her PC and yes it has had problems. That said she has a giant music collection, that had the same problems with Windows Media Player as well.
Waethorn
on Jul 17, 2008
"Of course it's not meaningful." Yes, that's true of your typical drivel, losta. "AVG 9 will treat iTunes as Malware." I already do - just like for Quicktime and Safari. "I just don't want to install iTunes on her PC. Can one of you call her and explain this?" >:D ....
ntman68
on Jul 17, 2008
I have moved away from iTunes, but not for reliability reasons. I sync my iPod and Zune from my Media Center (Yes, Paul, I am one of those crazies that connects the MC directly to the TV ;) ) and I mostly use the devices for podcasts. I am a music subscription user, so niether of those devices works for me. Anyway, I was noticing that the higher-res video podcasts that I am subscribing to were very choppy during playback. I thought it was my hardware, but when I played the same content back from the Zune software, smooth as glass. Go figure. The Gen1 Zune is now the player of choice and the Touch is gathering dust.
wdowell
on Jul 17, 2008
Even on my relatively new Dell XPS 1330m (2.2ghz, Core2duo) iTunes is so slow, and so annoying with the lines getting all messed up. It's ridiculous. I open it up half the time to a black block with only the sycning graphic showing through (when there's my iphone plugged in), and need to maximize it to clear it up. I've seen it run beautifully on Apple machines, but I, like the majority of iPhone/ ipod users, have a PC. Oddly enough, Safari seems to work fine on Windows. Cant they port iTunes the same way?
wdowell
on Jul 17, 2008
PS without getting into the whole nonsense about "apple vs pc", Windows Media Player 11 works beautifully on my PC. you can click through stuff in a breez, no stuttering etc. I cant accept its the volume of files i have.
cesjr
on Jul 17, 2008
"'m not sure if this is meaningful, but the desktop is running Vista x64 while the Macbook is running Vista x86 (32-bit)." Could be that because so few people are running Vista x64 (comparatively), Apple hasn't gotten (and run down) as many bug reports for iTunes on Vista x64.
Dipsh t Admin
on Jul 17, 2008
"Apple passes Acer to become third largest U.S. PC vendor -- Now has 8.5 percent market share." Two things. First, this is a trolling comment. Not related to the post, but this is the stuff trolls do. Second, what, market share matters now? I've said plenty of times that market share only matters to Apple fans when it's favorable. Otherwise it is irrelevant. If it isn't important, why troll and mention it?
cgdams
on Jul 17, 2008
Actually, ITunes is the main reason i'm not getting an IPhone or an IPod Touch. My personal experience with ITunes, at least with the windows version, is quite bad: It's a true resource hog, not really reliable (at least when synching my IPod 6G), has limited functions (for instance no copying music back from the IPod to my disk), pushes other software onto my machine that i don't like (Quicktime, Safari) and tries to take over all media oriented functions of my system. Fortunately, there are alternate software solutions for my IPod 6G (I'm using Winamp, combined with a special open source plugin), so i'm not forced to use another MP3 Player to avoid ITunes. But I guess, as long as ITunes is necessary to run an IPhone, i'll keep avoiding both.
Waethorn
on Jul 17, 2008
"Could be that because so few people are running Vista x64 (comparatively), Apple hasn't gotten (and run down) as many bug reports for iTunes on Vista x64." There's that spin again. Apple won't test and certify their software for Windows (like their drivers provided in Boot Camp), so their customers suffer from their incompetence. Certification would've proven that their software runs equally well (or in their case, probably equally badly) in Vista x64 as it does in x86. It would've provided customer confidence in purchasing Apple products to work in a Windows ecosystem. ....where is that old pappy now to try and convince people that Apple is somehow open and interoperable?? This is just more proof to the contrary. "I've said plenty of times that market share only matters to Apple fans when it's favorable. Otherwise it is irrelevant." Kind of like the overall role of the US marketshare vs. worldwide....still 3% worldwide.
DRWAM
on Jul 17, 2008
cgdams, what is the link for the 'special open source plugin'? Thanks, Doc
Ocean
on Jul 17, 2008
Name calling is so juvenile.
joe-dokes
on Jul 17, 2008
Guess what is the most interesting line from Paul's post? His mac book running vista is his most reliable computer. Think about it, Apple builds a great piece of hardware that has been superbly engineered and tested. Thus, it runs microsoft software better than most microsoft computers. As a result if you truly want the most reliable version of vista your first step should be to buy a Mac. Further, if you want the FASTEST version of windows on a laptop you should buy a Macbook Pro. Further, not owning a PC I can't comment on the reliability of iTunes on a PC. That being the hyperbole here is hysterical. From the posts you'd think that iTunes would cause your machines to burst into flames. I absolutely support your right to not install iTunes on your PC. It's too bad you can't uninstall IE. Second, Quicktime is a requirement of iTunes because iTunes uses portions of it when running. Thus, if you believe Quicktime is evil, you have chosen not to install iTunes. Gee paul considering your response to lotsamystuff, I think the winjihadist term hits a nerve. I think I will now use it routinely just to push your button. Regards Joe Dokes Joe Dokes
RunTimeError
on Jul 17, 2008
Wow. iTunes on both my Mac and my PC run fine. Even when I'm syncing my iPod. Imagine that. Outlook 2007, on the other hand, is a resource hogging POS. I hate it.
Tero
on Jul 17, 2008
"I absolutely support your right to not install iTunes on your PC. It's too bad you can't uninstall IE." My PC does not have IE on it -- so I guess it can be done. No, I do not have iTunes either.
Tero
on Jul 17, 2008
"Honestly brother is there no other news but Apple news. What is the name of this site? It needs to be changed." Paul used to provide interesting (and relevant) content back when the this thing was called Internet Nexus... first read it some 8 or 9 years ago, or something like that... Can't remember. Sure, Paul was obsessed with the Dell-Linux-Windows trinity back then, and of course, bashing Linux and HP when possible in favour of Dell and Windows 2000/Me was his blogging pastime of choice; but if you filtered out all the mandatory frivolity it was packed in, there was a lot of good stuff buried here and there and in between -- some very spot-on commentary you did not get anywhere else, and of course, good, all-in-one coverage on the relevant trends taking place in the MS-land, projected against the developments on the opensource front. Some of that was on WinInfo, as well, which, too, by the way, has now become AppleInfo weekly news, but whatever. Then, some years later, Paul became suddenly obsessed with Apple and OS X. Quality took a nosedive. Commentary was replaced with froth. Nexus became just another partisan fan blog. And now... well checking this on weekly or monthly rather than on daily basis (as in the past), shows the current obsession is Apple in general and iPhone in particular. Oh well. Paul has always had a thing for downplaying and mocking "little-used" products and technologies. "The six people out there using this non-MS product x will rejoice when Y announced that..."; "This product z, that no-one uses, is now..." etc. Yet, curiously enough, he is himself now fixated on Apple products, all of which--save the iPod--are irrelevant in their respective markets. They are deep down in the niche category. Anyway... SuperSite for Windows blog? LOL. SuperSite for Jobs, rather. But the world can always do with a new Apple site. There certainly are not enough of them around yet.
tayme
on Jul 17, 2008
@joe-dokes - "Thus, it runs microsoft software better than most microsoft computers." Uhm...can you point me to where I can look at the specs of one of those "microsoft computers"? --tayme
mbrose
on Jul 17, 2008
I'm with you on this one Paul. For me ITunes on Vista is by far the worst application. It slows my machine to a crawl and constantly has connection problems with my IPod. I really like the Shuffle form factor for running, but finally broke down and bought a Sansa Express because I was sick of spending 30-45 minutes every time I wanted to load new podcasts just trying to get the ITunes to work.
techboy2000
on Jul 17, 2008
iTunes has always been a buggy crash machine on Windows. I have dreamed of the day when Microsoft added h.264 support and a podcast client so I could drop iTunes. ITunes also crashed two times last week on my OSX Mac. The Mac crashes were worse than Windows crashes. I wasn't doing anything exotic except creating playlists.
bburzycki
on Jul 17, 2008
Let me add - constant issues with the Itunes Outlook Add-in Hanging Outlook ....
MLomasIcomm
on Jul 17, 2008
I gotta say, it's been a while since i tried using iTunes on Windows, but when I did, it was horrible to use. It seemed like a badly unresponsive application. Of course, on a Mac it works fine (go figure), but you'd have thought that the best way for Apple to promote itself to Windows users as the purveyors of fine, quality software - would be to provide them with fine, quality software.
cgdams
on Jul 18, 2008
@DRWRAM: Try http://mlipod.sf.net Have been using that plugin since years now, works like a charm and is much better than the IPod PlugIn Winamp already has...
cgdams
on Jul 18, 2008
@techboy2000, concerning h.264 and podcast support: I'm using VLC Media player (www.videolan.org) to play my h.264-coded videos and Winamp (www.winamp.com) combined with the open source IPod plugin at mlipod.sf.net as a podcast client. At least with my IPod 6G, that works very well for me.
Dipsh t Admin
on Jul 18, 2008
Of course, if it is lightweight audio/video playback that you want, I am a big fan of the K-Lite Mega Codec Pack and the QuickTime Alternative. Both options combined give you playback of nearly any type of media, without the fluff and bloat you get with iTunes/QuickTime and Windows Media Player.
arosania
on Jul 18, 2008
This should be regarded as the most stupid (retarded) post I have read in a looooong time. My "Vista reliability monitor" shows about the same as Paul's but with Excel.exe... Does that entitle me to publish something with the headline "Excel is unreliable"? Give me a break... this is just another linkbait for the iCabal and to give a sense of pride to the WinCabal/PaulCabal (weedmonk, drwam, dipshitadmin, cgdams) Seriously. Grow up. Get a life.
Dipsh t Admin
on Jul 18, 2008
Lump me in to the WinCabal if you like, but there is no absolutely no reason to include DRWAM.
johnpapola
on Jul 18, 2008
Great title, Paul. You've really jumped the shark in your Apple product coverage on this blog. So the title says categorically and unequivocally that "iTunes is not reliable"... ...and then it turns out that it could be your desktop PC, or 64bit Vista which seems to be a niche product for consumers, or who really knows. Weird, right? How can you honestly lambast your fellow pundits about snark and hyperbole when you do this kind of thing on your own blog? Seriously. Talk about the absolute definition of hypocrisy.
johnpapola
on Jul 18, 2008
I will also defend DRWAM and Dipsht as being reasonable guys. They're not winCabal apple-bashing hacks like so many of the other members of this deteriorating blog's community.
DRWAM
on Jul 18, 2008
cgdams, Thanks. I will give it a try soon after I get home from vacation. My older Sansa's can just drag and drop music. However, I lost this ability on the newer c series with XP and Leopard, but I can still drag and drop with Vista. Can't do it on the iPod as you know without this, so thanks.
jeffhex
on Jul 18, 2008
I was wondering if you checked your Outlook PST file with SCANPST.EXE to make sure there was not anything a little bit corrupted in it that might me causing iTunes to crash. I've found that my other sync applications (like my old Palm software) have had problems with my outlook files in that past when there is some data corruption in them, and SCANPST.EXE sometimes cleans that problem for me.
DRWAM
on Jul 18, 2008
Ah shucks, thanks for the support. But does this mean that neither the Wincabal or iCabal want me?;)
johnpapola
on Jul 18, 2008
Coming from a family of doc's in the PA/NJ area, you'll always have a place on my team, buddy.
Waethorn
on Jul 19, 2008
"I have dreamed of the day when Microsoft added h.264 support and a podcast client so I could drop iTunes." They do! -> http://www.zune.net ;) "K-Lite Mega Codec Pack and the QuickTime Alternative" ....is actually illegal. "64bit Vista which seems to be a niche product for consumers" It seems that Gateway would disagree with that assessment, as do I. Most of their consumer systems that are sold today (and all of mine, ever since SP1), include the 64-bit versions by default. Even HP's business systems include Vista x64.
DRWAM
on Jul 19, 2008
Thanks John. I was about to cry with my 3 little ones comforting daddy, the only non x-cabal guy in Jersey. Currently I am experiencing problems updating to Vista SP1. screens behind the update window are appearing and need a response [OK or accept or whatever] but I did not see them as they were behind the Window and did not show in the task bar or whatever you call it. I was watching for progress for over an hour. Also. I installed Sun's Java software for the medical cloud, as it was offered at the initial sign on page at the hospital web, but it wanted to install an update, which Vista suspended the SP1 update because of it. Also, the box to install OpenOffice suite was checked off during Sun's Java update. I unchecked it, but think that was BS. I have Office 2007 anyway, but if you blinked, or you are a 6 or 7 yr old, you'd probably just accept or OK it and it's installed. I find that stinky. So I probably interrupted installation myself, but after a fresh restart, I finally manage not a screw it up.
johnpapola
on Jul 20, 2008
@Waethorn, I'm simply repeating what I've heard from Paul, which is that for a least a while, Vista 64bit had relatively poor driver and application compatibility. It seems like it's the better system, though and I am all for Microsoft's moves to break compatibility in favor of progress. Still, gateway is a niche PC maker now and HP's "business systems" don't help your argument that 64bit isn't a consumer niche. That said... you're probably right and I defer to your expertise regarding Vista. Regardless... the hyperbole and hypocrisy of this headline and post still stand. It's link-baiting at it's worst.
Waethorn
on Jul 20, 2008
"least a while, Vista 64bit had relatively poor driver and application compatibility" That was also true of the 32-bit version, at least for some hardware. Neither is true now though - the market is flooded with "Certified..." hardware. "gateway is a niche PC maker now " WHAAAA....?! Gateway is in the top 6 PC makers worldwide - at least, they WERE. Now they are part of Acer, which is #3 in overall systems worldwide, and #1 notebook maker worldwide. "HP's "business systems" don't help your argument that 64bit isn't a consumer niche." Maybe not, but if it's included in business machines (where compatibility is a much, MUCH bigger issue), then it doesn't mean much for consumers to adopt it - and they have, at least in compatibility respects. The amount of hardware on the market now that supports 64-bit versions of Windows Vista far outweighs what doesn't, and the hardware that's left that doesn't, probably never will be certified because the manufacturers are flat-out ignorant. Similarly, the unsupported and uncertified hardware is what causes 90% of problem on Windows.
lotsamystuff
on Jul 21, 2008
"My "Vista reliability monitor" shows about the same as Paul's but with Excel.exe... Does that entitle me to publish something with the headline "Excel is unreliable"?" Of course you wouldn't do that, because you're not an unreasonable WinJihadist.
subzerohitman721
on Jul 21, 2008
I think this article has merit. Just looking over itunes downloads, you'll see what he's talking about. The original iTunes for Windows version 4.1 for windows was a 19 MB download. At version 5.0 and 6.0 iTunes was a 33 MB download. At version 7.0, iTunes was up to 37 MB. The current version 7.7.0.43 is 60.5 MB. On the Mac side, iTunes 1.0 on the classic is 3 MB. The highest the classic side's version of iTunes got was iTunes 5 at 14 MB. On the OS-X side, Version 1.1 was 3 MB. Version 2 was 4 MB. Version 3 was 6 MB. Version 4 was 8 MB. Version 5 was 14 MB. Version 6 was 12 MB. Version 7 was 25 MB. The current version is 48.32 MB. Now if we look at WMP, the orginal version 5.1 was a download of 156kb. Version 6.4 was 3 MB. Version 7 was 9 MB. Version 9 was 10 MB for XP, 13 MB for 2000 and 98. Version 10 was 12 MB. Version 11 is currently at 24.5 MB. Winamp current versions are the free one for 9.08 MB and the full version at 12.7 MB. This is a huge disparity. I too have notice iTunes ever slowing functionality. Even though its currently my main media player, its getting slower than previous version. In my opinion, I believe iTunes is suffering from code bloat. If WMP can do almost everything iTunes does with less space, then Apple needs to recode the iTunes player for speed and less disk space. If Winamp can compete with both with less, both Microsoft and Apple have work to do. However, I think WMP size for a media player is reasonable. I think since many people who are iTunes users are attesting to the same problem, then there's more to it than a simple "WinJihadist" argument. (Although I'd argue that Apple CEO Steve Jobs compares his work with a religious/mindexpanding experience, I"ve never heard Bill Gates utter anything like that. But I'll have that argument for another debate.)
johnpapola
on Jul 21, 2008
Subzero, Couldn't it be that iTunes on the Mac relies on OSX libraries located in the operating system whereas iTunes on Windows must bundle these re-written libraries with the application? I don't think file size and a metric for stability and reliability that has any merit unto itself. Waethorn, I forgot that Acer bought Gateway. The last time I even remember hearing about Gateway, they were selling about the same number of PCs as Apple sells Macs, hence my niche comment. Of course, Gateway couldn't survive on it's own while Apple is thriving.

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